Kategorijos aptarimas:Ido

What's the point of this category if there is already Category:Ido kalba? I created a redirect to avoid confusion (until this is deleted) but was reverted. There are many other Wiktionaries pointing to this category as being the main category for Ido. Malafaya 14:27, 15 balandžio 2010 (UTC)

Well, this category is a category-redirect to the main one, Category:Ido kalba (literally Ido language). We've decided to use these category-redirects as in English Wikipedia (because I guess categories-redirects may be used in fr.wikt and en.wikt in the near future. The reason for this is to make searching by categories easier - for example, if you look for a particular category [[cat:Ido]], you will be redirected to the main one, and if this category-redirect did not exist, the searcher would find no results. About the word kalba: all the categories in lt.wiki contain this word, even Category:Sanskrit and Esperanto, in order to prevent trivial discussions about how to name one categories or another. Unlike in English, it is uncommon to use an adjective alone when referring to a language. For example, we usually say portugalų kalba, lietuvių kalba, anglų kalba, when talking about languages, while portugalų, lietuvių, anglų is possible only in casual spoken language. --Viskonsas 15:10, 15 balandžio 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply, Viskonsas. Wouldn't the redirect I made earlier do? My question here is that some days ago the category Category:Esperanto was just deleted (and not soft-redirected) which was a much better solution for the interwiki bots at least: there won't be an ambiguous corresponding category in lt.wikt and thus the interwikis can be updated. With 2 categories being matched by other Wiktionaries, the processing will be aborted. Anyway, I asked Volkov at ru.wiki to try correcting all other Wiktionaries with his bot. Thanks again, Malafaya 15:18, 15 balandžio 2010 (UTC)

Maybe you are right. I don't know if the idea of creating these categories-redirects is good (actually it was my idea, and Vpovilaitis had nothing against it), because it has many cons, some of which you've already noticed (problem for bots). However, I will contact Vpovilaitis to decide whether the simple redirects are better (because it's uncommon to simply redirect categories). Anyway, talking about category:Espeanto, it would be too early to undelete it and make it a soft-redirect, because it might make bots really confused, don't you think? Thanks. --Viskonsas 15:41, 15 balandžio 2010 (UTC)

Yes, probably. That was my point actually :). Deleting the category or creating hard-redirect solves problem for bots. A soft- or no redirect will break the autonomous category processing by bots. But for the Ido category, things will be solved manually

In the Portuguese Wiktionary, we had a similar problem some time ago, but it was a problem even when hard-redirects existed: if someone for an accident happens to put something in these fake categories, probably no one will ever notice it. As for a wrong non-existing category, the mistake will appear in Special:WantedCategories. I don't know what's better. Maybe Vitas knows better. Malafaya 15:48, 15 balandžio 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. I even haven't thought of the problem "real redirects" can cause (I mean, that somebody could put one article into the redirect category without anyone noticed). However, I think that Vitas has already solved this problem: there is a special parameter for soft-redirects containing subcategories or articles, so if the article is put into a fake category, it will be automatically set down to Kategorija:Netuščios nukreipiamosios kategorijos (Category:Non-empty redirect-categories). --Viskonsas 16:05, 15 balandžio 2010 (UTC)